Saturday 16 May 2009

Behind the Scenes

The venue for the second GP of 2009 was my home club Millride. Here is a look at behind the scenes to offer some insight into what it takes to put on an FT GP.
It started some weeks ago with a few work parties to determine where the first 28 targets would go. Paint marked the spots, new brackets were fixed and lines of sight were cut. A meeting established what new equipment was required and it was Dave Pitt who set about purchasing rope, paint, whistles, stakes, gazebo, nails, cable ties etc. Well done Dave!

On the Saturday before the event it began with the shooting line and then the targets were positioned, strings attached and sight lines cleared; the amount of spring growth was incredible but by lunch time 28 targets were in position and ready for action. A short respite whilst the rain came down and we moved to the wood. This is our usual shooting area so needed less preparation, it was here that we could position some high targets so ladder work was required. The numbers that adorned each target and lane were the work of Daz Tomes! With the wood complete it was off home for food a quick beer and an early night.
Dawn signalled the start of the shoot day and very soon after we assembled for business. Check the targets, the line, the numbers, assemble the gazebo, position the chrono, check for loo roll, put out signs, put out the plinkers, clocks on each lane, measure and stake out the silhouettes and there were 150+ cards to hand out; thanks to Sam!
A few competitors chose to walk the course. Here Dave Schofield offers Phil and Greg some pointed advice!
All was now ready and after a few words from our Chairman, Ian Stoddart, the GP was underway.
One thing out of our control was the weather and it was foul. Strong wind was only interrupted by gale force wind and horizontal rain. Check out Phil Tetstall's windicator!
The conditions were by far the worse I have experienced and even the best were finding it tricky; his words were not printable!
Dave tries to read that wind ...and Paula looks to be reading a book!
I watched Tony Fouracres have a real mare in the field but he kept smiling and recovered to score 29.
Inevitably when it seems impossible to most some manage to produce high scores. Neale Marklew from Far Coley posted an impressive 38 and James Woodhead went one better with 39.
I marshalled the morning session and watched many shaken heads as targets remained upright but I remained optimistic that when it was my turn things would go okay!
With freshly painted targets the afternoon session began. I was on lane 1 with Mark "Berty" Bassett and Rich Chasemore. I watched Berty miss the first pair but was still convinced I'd manage; how wrong I was. Those first two misses were the only I saw in the field and after 20 targets only 6 had bit the dust. The wood brought some welcome relief and a few more fell over including this one which would later bring unexpected reward!
The afternoon round was complete but the work was far from over. The targets came in quickly; I saw these and thought about stamping on them.
Many hands had worked hard in preparing for this event but two people deserve a particular mention. John "Jonta" Cox and Darren Tomes for their tireless work and innovative thinking.

Whilst the hustle of work continued there was need for a shoot-off in A grade. Mark Charlton secured his second win of the season with a fine kneeling shot on target 34; hard luck to Michael C Cotter. Well done Mark!
So GP2 was over and a victory for James Woodhead. His 39 was not threatened in the afternoon that is except for one man, Marc Fisher, who scored 37 with a springer!!

Despite the weather it was a great experience that left us all tired yet satisfied. Finally me, Roy and Greg shared a shandy in the Parkbrook contemplating our poor scores but still keenly awaiting Iceni!

446 comments:

1 – 200 of 446   Newer›   Newest»
Baltipal said...

Well done Shaun on a great write up, took me right back but I'm not sure I wanted that given my abysmal performance!
A disastrous result for me Sunday, 16ex50/41%. A real trip back to the bad old days. The reasons were perhaps obvious but although the conditions were atrocious others seemed to handle them much better than I.
I've shot in heavier rain & in truth it doesn't bother me too much. I've shot in strong winds & as long as they're consistent I know I can get some kind of solution eventually but the combination of the two meant I was missing but not able to see my POI to make the necessary adjustment! I heard several times Sunday how people watched their pellets do this & do that & as a result managed some kind of reasonable, (considering the weather) score but if I could do the day again I couldn't do it differently because I got no feedback atall from any of the targets!
Well, clearly that has to be my worst score of this Season. I still have this nagging feeling my MV is dropping but still unconfirmed due to a question mark over the Chrono's performace on the day because of the rain.
The Course was great though & Millride put on a really good show. a credit to the region, largely down to a couple of individuals, nice one Jonta & Daz. Thanks for all your efforts, don't think for a second they're not appreciated fellas!
Ho Hum, onwards & upwards. Bring on Iceni!

Here are some photo's of the event;

http://w214.photobucket.com/pbwidget.swf?pbwurl=http://w214.photobucket.com/albums/cc267/Baltipal/GP2%20Millride%20May%2009/c9e5b6ca.pbw

Baltipal said...

Now that I've had a shower, brushed my teeth & my brain has woken up a bit more, it seems to me that while the lot of us deserve a slap on the back for putting on that show Sunday, well done to all of us! Individuals do stand out for special mention such as Jonta & daz but I think I need to state my appreciation first of all for our Chairman Ian,(Though I doubt he'll ever read it here!) It can't be easy to stand up knowing you are the focus of 80 odd blokes & speak to them when you may not have done it before & then do it all again in the P.M. Nice one Ian.
Also, Shaun. Opporating behind the scenes fielding entrys, cancellations, requests to change sessions & lanes & dealing with late entrys, all requiring prompt E-mail responce & not a small amount of planning & liason with BFTA. Then turning up to do the physical stuff, then sitting down & writing a blog about it!
Nice one Shaunie, I'll get you a beer in matey!

Arby said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Arby said...

Well said Greg. I'd like to second your comments about the driving forces behind a GP which will long be remembered by everyone that took part. Thank you Daz, Jonta, Ian and Shaun. Thanks also to those that competed with a stoical smile on their faces despite the conditions.

Greg, I'm not exactly sure of what I learned either, but I'm sure we both learned quite a lot from the experience without knowing exactly what.

CB Chairman said...

Evening guys I'm just off swimming so I hope to come back to a raging FT debate.

Baltipal said...

Well, I don't know if I've learned anything that I didn't know before. Difficult conditions will show up short comings in your form & your equipment in away that reasonably good conditions just don't so, get Trudy up to 800fps+, lose weight & bring my right leg up in the seated position & apply perfect follow through to start seeing the pellets as they strike.
Not going to happen anytime soon though.

Phil_G said...

Evening all.
Greg, regarding the 'right leg up'.
I've been trying this for a while now, and I've found it to be a hindrance. Maybe if I practised more with it, it might eventually prove to be of benefit, but for us of the slightly larger proportions, I've found it 'cramps' me up and causes my breathing to become erratic.
Look at Phil J. He shoots right leg straight out, and he's doing pretty well with it.
I agree that it is the accepted norm, but it may not be ideal for some of us.

CB Chairman said...

Well I'm considering lowering my left leg. It is perhaps why some shooters have such long hamsters. Note that the new EV has a longer hamster

Phil_G said...

Although there is an 'ideal' position to create the 3 point location, I think it's also important to be able to breathe consistently, something I am completely unable to do, particularly on 'uphill' shots.
Its lever lengths, some people have the ideal ratios.
I look at some of the positions guys get into for kneelers and I can see why I'm so poo at them...

CB Chairman said...

But we will fight through!!!

CB Chairman said...

Being of less than the perfect shape for FT we (well at least me) will soldier on and keep on trying.

Phil_G said...

I see.
Oh to be normal.

Phil_G said...

Do you think spending an inordinate amount of money on a gun will prove to be a suitable alternative to the ideal physique, 20/20 vision and natural talent?

CB Chairman said...

Of course not but it might make you feel good. Which is perhaps more important!

Baltipal said...

Yes Phil, Phil J does buck the trend but may be the exception that proves the rule.
It was forcefully demonstrated to me Sunday when one of my shooting partners, Kate said she would need to use the disabled kneeling position due to a disability. It proved to be remarkably like my ordinary seated position, this has been deemed to be less supportive than the proscribed seated position by the BFTA!
Breathing is the issue with this, hense the need to lose belly.

Phil_G said...

Clearing the course will make me feel good.

Baltipal said...

James Osborne has put his photos up now;

http://digitalvault.bt.com/photo/slideshowV3-my.jsp

Phil_G said...

Greg, without questioning our dedication, the likelihood is that neither of us will be waif like any time soon.
Maybe we should look to adapt the ideal position to our current extremities? :)

Willbe said...

Hiya guys....

Well first of all I do want to thank you all and say you did yourselves proud, it all looked like it went to plan and weather aside the day certainly looked a success from here. As for the scores yes they wasn't high but in the conditions, just to stick with it and complete the course was an acheavement in its own right!
Greg as for the leg up/down debate, the thing to do is try both and see which works the best, if the "ideal" position cocks up your breathing then it is far from ideal. Try stuff and go with what works and bin the stuff that doesnt.

Cheers for now...
Will

Willbe said...

Phil, Greg, exactly in the same boat here, just trying stuff and see what works and what doesnt.

Will

Baltipal said...

The way I see it is this, the reason way you miss a target can be summed up in three elements;
1/ Technique/Form

2/ Equipment, Pellets/Rifle/Scope/Set up

3/Conditions
As long as you've got your set up/equipment right & allowing for the vagaries of the British weather, it's all down to form. An 'alright' position will take you so far but all the wrinkles need to be ironed out to achieve top form.

Phil_G said...

just read your 'difficulty' document Mr C.
I can see how the Troyer scale can make simple differentiations between courses based on length, but when you factor in the scores, surely this is heavily dependent on weather conditions?
Using the scores, then surely our GP will prove to be the hardest, but isn't so much of that down to weather?

swiftyx2 said...

Shaun,

Well done on write up again, and big thanks to you for your help on Sunday (true gent).

Millride crew,
Big thanks and well done for a great course (it would still have been a tough one even in good weather)some good lanes that had you thinking.

Nice to see you all again and catch up.

Have you gents got your kit dried yet???,
after that soaking new waterproofs are next on my list to purchase.
With ref to lowering your left leg Shaun drop the hampster and raise your hook. My hampster is now low and the rifle stays rock steady then I just raise and lower hook depending on target height.Go on get a GEMMINI,LOL.

Phil_G said...

http://www.jsramsbottom.com/cgi-bin/jsr.cgi/dynamiclink?qr=668f&qk=27eb78612657ebb01a8afb70617ac992&a=1&b=0&z=0&aP=0&source=/GCP/GCP_guncases_soft.HTM

Greg, my case is the bottom one.
Sorry, we didn't try Trudy in it on Sunday, lets try this Saturday

Baltipal said...

Hiya Steve, you up & about or laid low by the exertions of Sunday?

Baltipal said...

Cheers Phil. It's a possibility that I wont be able to attend Saturday however! I'm in the process of changing cars & was hopeing to do the deal tomorrow but reality has stepped in with a swift kick up the bum & I may be carless for a couple of days.

Willbe said...

Phil, Troyer does give a weighting for wind of 1.25 dificulty rating. However as much as I can tell he does not quantify wind, just giving it a blanket value.

Greg the trick with that though is finding the optimum that works for you, unfortunately one size doesnt fit all

CB Chairman said...

Hi Steve! Thanks for that info I will give it a try.

Phil now that's what we want debate. I fully agree that the weather is a major factor, however, that is not what I set out to explore. The scores will tell you that Millride was a tricky course but, having not done the Troyer yet, my money is that it will prove the most difficult course yet. In truth what interests me is "am I improving as an FT shooter?". Last week I scored 42 ex 50 but the course was easy. I cannot compare my score even as a percentage purely based on others performance.

CB Chairman said...

Right I'm in Excel

Baltipal said...

Yeah Will, but the optimum position for you or me as individuals isn't the optimum position to take the shot, that's the point!
There is a proper form to a position & that's what we need to adopt, the most comfortable for us will only take us so far. It's uncomfortable, our muscles cramp, we can't breathe, tough, make it work! Three points of contact gives the best support.
If you look at other, more formal shooting sports, the sort of thing that have Coaches, the positions are clearly very formalised.

Phil_G said...

In truth what interests me is "am I improving as an FT shooter?"Thats easy, you don't need Troyer for that.

No, you are not.

Hope that helps.

Simples. (c) Alexander the Meerkat.

Phil_G said...

Greg,
take a look at the swing of golfer Jim Furyk.
If your swing was like that, every coach in the world would tell you you're doing it wrong and would change it and give you a 'standard' swing.

Phil_G said...

Hey guys, Shaun is busy adding up and taking away.
We can say naughty words and he won't notice.

swiftyx2 said...

Hi Greg,

Up today thanks, hospital in morning might get a telling off but it was worth it. Had great day pity could not have managed to stay for shoot off, Mark would have been 2nd to me,LOL. My chance of glory gone!!!!.

Arby said...

Evening Gents. I've enjoyed the debate on shooting positions and have to confess that despite being blessed with the proportions of a Greek God, from time to time I share your earthly problems. My answer is to use what you lot mockingly called my "yoga positions". Try them for yourselves and you too may aspire to 18/39.

Seriously though, my take on it is to shoot from whatever position is comfortable on the day. Even with the ideal position you're still more likely to miss if you're uncomfortable

Baltipal said...

Again.....exceptions that prove the rule. If everyone swung like Jim Furyk, no low flying bird or passing motorist would be safe!
Everyone's body shape is different but that doesn't negate the fact that there are positions that optimise support & minimise movement & therefore should be the jumping off point for adaptation once achieved.
..............but, I still can't get my right leg up!!!!!!!!

swiftyx2 said...

Greg, Ref shooting position I have spent more time getting this right than actualy shooting, due to health problem. Spend some time on it in garden and work out your natural aim points in each position. hard to explain in text will give you a call Wed if you like?.

CB Chairman said...

Okay Greg the diet starts NOW!!!

Phil_G said...

Which one are you? Artemis, the virgin goddess of the hunt?

swiftyx2 said...

Night Gents.

Phil_G said...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HPS-AKTIV-Free-Rifle-Butt-Plate-Target-Anschutz-FWB_W0QQitemZ260411707254QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_SportingGoods_OtherSports?hash=item260411707254&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1688|66%3A5|65%3A12|39%3A2|240%3A1318|301%3A0|293%3A1|294%3A25

HPS buttplate if you fancy one

CB Chairman said...

Phil thanks for your support.

The computer says "YES". In summary; the mean length was longer at GP2 than GP1, the kneeling was longer, the longer shots were longer, the standers were closer. Only the reducers were considerably easier.

We cannot transfer the wind from one place to another but we can compare the length and disciplines etc.

It has been suggested that we should have moved the line in the field some yards closer. I wander if we had what would the outcome have been? Perhaps James Woodhead would not have won and his superb performance might not have been rewarded. Certainly if they had been closer some of us would have scored more but ... I think it was hard but the same for all.

Phil_G said...

I don't really see what that would have achieved?
I guess its expected that the top competitors should make their sport look easy.
That's why they like golf competitions to be won by 20 under, and the like.
Bringing the line in 5 yards would have increased the scores by ~5(?)
Should all GP's be won with a 49?

Baltipal said...

Cheers Phil, Mmmm, 210quid, more than my flight to Spain! I suppose I'll have to take the plunge eventually but I'm still holding out for a good unlicensed copy from John at Castle.
I nearly timed out on the standers in the field on Sunday, just couldn't hold still. Double dink!

Phil_G said...

to be fair, I think it was said with a good amount of tongue in cheek.

CB Chairman said...

No.

Phil_G said...

http://www.pmcb.co.uk/sitefiles/Pages/Steyr/Photo_Gallery6/main.html

I shall be trying one of these babies.
Not sure if Phil Hassel could do one to suit Trudy?

CB Chairman said...

This could be like the Two Ronnies sketch when the answers came before the questions.

Phil_G said...

four candles?

Phil_G said...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0C59pI_ypQ

CB Chairman said...

What would you use to make that evening a touch romantic?

Baltipal said...

The Course was set out to challenge & test, it did just that. It was the bloody weather that upset the applecart(Do I sound bitter?) no one can allow for what the British weather can do, it either bakes you, soaks you, blows you off your feet or freezes your toes off. We could all be sunburned & dehydrated at Iceni!

Phil_G said...

a woman?

CB Chairman said...

Outstanding Youtube Phil. Did you post it yourself?

Phil_G said...

nope, just googled it

CB Chairman said...

Gosh! I clicked the wrong button and suddenly all your comments were e-mailed to me. For a short time I thought I was popular!

Phil_G said...

then reality set in?

I may be leaving my beloved Google for Wolfram.

CB Chairman said...

now you're talking Greek

Phil_G said...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8052798.stm

Baltipal said...

Nighty-night fellas.

Phil_G said...

night.

Baltipal said...

I've just emulsioned the kitchen ceiling & glossed the window sills, I thought I'd be changing my car today not doing DIY! Looking more & more like the weekend.

Baltipal said...

Where is everybody?
Just comeback from the 49th after 20 rounds of .38spl, well 19 really, one had a dud primer cap.

JONTA said...

Hello Greg how `s things

Baltipal said...

Superfine matey, still waiting for the new car & I've spent my day painting things but I have just been shooting so it's all OK now.

JONTA said...

What car you having then m8

CB Chairman said...

Evening Greg and Jonta.

Phil_G said...

evening all

Baltipal said...

My brother-in-law's Mondeo estate 1.8lxtd

CB Chairman said...

Interstate FT tour bus!

Baltipal said...

All Aboard!

JONTA said...

Finally got car sorted today, after having alternator stripped down again.

Phil when do you hope to set up your Steyr

Phil_G said...

Saturday, if the weather is ok.
Ive used chairgun to get some rough clicks worked out. need to get a zero and check some distances.

Phil_G said...

I like the hydrographics muzzle flip:
http://www.hydro-graphics.co.uk/services.php
(bottom right)
So, I e-mailed them to find out how much they are.



£85 + £6.50 delivery.

Gulp...

I need to get something before I set it up so that it doesn't alter my clicks when I've established them.

Baltipal said...

One of my fellow 'proby' mates, Ken has now got his FAC & bought a Ruger .308. He needed a scope & was advised to get a Fox 6-24 side paralaxing jobby. It has an illuminated centre dot & extremly clear optics. I noticed several of the Long guns there had them on, no idea what they'd focus down to though.

JONTA said...

Weather looks promising for saturday

Baltipal said...

Typical!

CB Chairman said...

Let's hope so. I need to boost my confidence. A run of 4 hits would be good

JONTA said...

still time for it go belly up

Phil_G said...

you're too late Jonta, we did bellies last night...

CB Chairman said...

3 1/2 hours to Iceni, phew!

Baltipal said...

A CHOCOLATE BANANA!

JONTA said...

Presume thats a weight thing then

CB Chairman said...

They were talking about positions Jonta but I thought it was too rude!

JONTA said...

Not a nice thought Mr C

Phil_G said...

we were discussing the benefits of right leg up.
Greg wants to do it. I do it, but it makes me pant like our dog cos of my belly.

JONTA said...

Noticed a shooter at Harriers GP who shot with virtually both legs straight, but he did have an hamster nearly as long as his gun

Baltipal said...

Was that the bloke that made me look like twiggy?

Baltipal said...

Shopping done now, hurrah!

JONTA said...

Blog Friday fellas

Baltipal said...

Evening bloggers. A bugger of a day at work today & tomorrow looks like being worse!

CB Chairman said...

Evening Gregor!

What you need is a walk down to the Barnt Green Inn, a couple of pints then a walk back.

Phil_G said...

evening bloggers

CB Chairman said...

Howdy Phil, I've just pulled the barrel through and I've raised my cheekpiece. Roll on Saturday!

Phil_G said...

did you know that fully constrained by the bolt and the 2 grubscrews, but with the front end free floated, the natural frequency of the Steyr barrel is 71.2Hertz?

Phil_G said...

but by adding a 250gram weight to the front end, it reduces to 50.7Hertz?

CB Chairman said...

Fascinating. I wondered what you'd been doing.

Phil_G said...

i was just about to say the same to you.

Phil_G said...

I'll have 100 before Greg

CB Chairman said...

So now you know there are 71.2 reasons why you miss those standing shots!!

Phil_G said...

Oh, there are many more than that.
I propose that air strippers/muzzle breaks improve accuracy not by improving pellet flight but but altering the natural frequency of the barrel.
So I propose the weight of the muzzle break is much more critical than the design.

CB Chairman said...

I'd expect a bit of calculus Mr Gee

Phil_G said...

I used Pro/Mechanica Finite Element Analysis software, is that OK?

CB Chairman said...

No, no software surfing thanks. Pure, hard rigid Fourier analysis please!

CB Chairman said...

I know those symbols can be tricky to write in Blogger!

Phil_G said...

only dinosaurs and NVH boffins use FFT and DTFT.
The rest of the world push buttons and get the answer in nice pretty colours.
Management like pretty colours

CB Chairman said...

I may do some analysis of some Jack Daniels shortly

Tesla said...

Evening lads.

Fascinating matter! Barrel Resonance frequency.

One of my proffesional contacts works for a Vibratory phenomemnon laboratory in Valladolid. He has some devices to obtain the characteristic resonance frequency in any part. He use some different accelerometers and catch the signals obtained with them.
Then the resonance frequency is calculated.

He told me two days a go and was offered to made this study with my Walther Dommy.

Do you have some experince like this ?

CB Chairman said...

Hola Jesus,

I shake that much I don't need to know the frequency.

Tesla said...

Yes, Shaun , me too.
You are right. But is very nice to dive in the theories.

Arby said...

Hello Boys. I'm thinking of experimenting with Mosquitos at the weekend. I understand that I'll need to increase the power, so how does one use the external power adjuster on the Steyr. I can see that there are holes in the gnurled adjuster knob and assume that a suitable implement has to be inserted in order to turn it. (Like an old fashioned capstan on a ship) But, am I correct in thinking that a suitable implement has to be inserted in one of those tiny holes on the side of the action in order to facilitate this.

OK, so I may not be the brightest button in the box, but your considerable technical expertise would be welcome.

CB Chairman said...

Hello Roy, you may find that the MV increases anyway.

Phil_G said...

I have the said technical implement. It is a short bar of mekal.
You put it any of the holes and turn clockwise to increase power and viki verka.
An allen key of a suitable size works as an alternative to the said technical implement.

Baltipal said...

Right, I've read back over the last few posts & I think Phil is trying to say that he can pick up Radio 4 on his Steyr, useful for the shipping forecasts anyway!

Tesla said...

Hola Greg.

The last week end weather marked your brains eh?

Phil_G said...

Jesus, we do the same thing with our propshafts to establish the bending frequencies.

Tesla said...

Yes,Phil. This is a new technology used more and more in the automotive industrie. We are keen to know and implement those devices in our laboratory, but they are quite critical and you need real expertises to work with.

Arby said...

I put the details for the JSB's into Chairgun and the clicks are pretty spot on. If I then compare the Mosquitos which are lighter (but with the same BC), and leave the fps at 690 the clicks are exactly the same. So I'm wondering why I should need to change the power at all. Is it because although the fps remains the same the energy falls from 10.83 Ft Lbf to 10.13 Is this logical or am I failing to understand ballistic fundamentals.
Thanks,
Mithered of Millride

Phil_G said...

Greg,
that may be the only useful thing it can do.
I attended a 'Better West Midlands' meeting today, available to anyone at risk of redundancy.
I fancy the foundation course in cake decorating.
My mate fancies the Indian head massage course.
Although they do Pest Control (rabbits and Moles). Maybe a bayonet fitted to the front end to charge the moles and I could make good use of the Steyr.
I could even claim the cost of it back as tools of the trade?

Phil_G said...

690? that sounds low.

Baltipal said...

Fancy a pint tomorrow night Shaun, you can have one of those I owe you?

Baltipal said...

Phil, if someone offers you a Course in something always take it, doesn't matter what it is!

Arby said...

Phil, That's what Russ Spencer was using it to such good effect with. And it also bears out something Gary Radford mentioned....that the Steyr and its regulator work more efficiently at that speed. (I think that's what he said, anyway)

Baltipal said...

Does anyone want to find out their Pirate name? Mines Red Tom Rackham apparently! Look here;

http://www.piratequiz.com/

Phil_G said...

when I change the pellet weight in Chairgun, the FPS changes, but the Energy stays the same.
at 770 with 8.44 I get 11.06ft/lb.
If I change to 7.9, I get 793FPS but still 11.06ft/lb

Baltipal said...

Jesús, I'm emotionally scarred amigo!

Arby said...

Sorry, my mistake. I meant 760.

Phil_G said...

Roy, with 8.4 pellets at 690FPS, I get 8.882ft/lb

Tesla said...

After we saw the piccies, Jose said: next year we need to make a course SNOWING and shooting with short trousers, like Andy Calpin.
His motion has been accepted.

Phil_G said...

Is the Skan now fully functional or is it still in a state of undress?

CB Chairman said...

Few sudden action.

Roy I was rather interested in your problem. Are you still blogging?

Skan not yet repaired but I have part.

Yes to a pint Greg, do you fancy a stroll through the Lickeys?

Baltipal said...

Sure, why not. I am suffering from a small affliction however that may effect that plan but I'll play it by ear,

Baltipal said...

Where's everyone gone?

Arby said...

I,m back. Or should I say RTK.

CB Chairman said...

So Roy share with us your problem

Baltipal said...

Hiya Roy. Have you got some mozzies to try then mate?

CB Chairman said...

Your gun problem that is!

Arby said...

Greg, I have 2 tins, bought at considerable expense from SFS.

I don't really know what my problem is. I think what I am saying is, if I leave the power as it is, according to Chairgun, the clicks stay the same even though the Mosquito is lighter. Why therefore, should I increase the power, which is the received wisdom.

Baltipal said...

They say they behave better downrange in wind matey.

Baltipal said...

Did Craig McDonald retire early on Sunday? I can't see a score for him.

CB Chairman said...

If you chrono at 690 with 8.4s then changing to 7.9s would increase your MV.
As your gun is running at 690 I would be inclined to turn the power up. With 8.4s I'd suggest that you need somewhere around 770-780 fps.

Baltipal said...

I think he's running at 760fps Shaun.

Phil_G said...

at 55 yards, 760 and 8.4 equals 51 clicks. changing to 7.9, gives 783fps and at 55 yards 46 clicks.
however, if you increase power to 805, you now only need 42 clicks.
so, increasing speed flattens out the curve.
obviously the actual clicks will depend on your scope height

Arby said...

Shaun, I mentioned earlier, but you probably missed it, that I typed 690 by mistake. I should have said 760

Phil_G said...

if you change to mozzies, and don't increase the mv, you should get 783 ish, which is perfectly acceptable.
However, it will change your clicks

CB Chairman said...

Sorry Roy I thought that was low.

As Phil said, using mozzies will flatten you ballistic curve (but not by much). As Greg said the users of mozzies claim they take less windage, but this will only show if you run them fast. The BFTA will allow 822 with them but most people run them about 810.

Tesla said...

Time to bed for me, mates.

Buenas noches.
Hasta mañana.

CB Chairman said...

Phil do you mean don't increase the power?

Baltipal said...

I dream of 810fps!

Arby said...

I'm happier to change the clicks than change what appears to be an efficient mv. Is this logical?

Baltipal said...

Hasta mañana amigo.

Baltipal said...

If it ain't broke don't fix it, but if you're changing pellets the MV may be better upped.

Arby said...

Goodnight Jesus.

CB Chairman said...

Buenas noches Jesus!

CB Chairman said...

I agree, to benefit from mozzies you want them flying fast.

Phil_G said...

what I'm saying is that 783 with mozzies is perfectly acceptable if it's the 'sweet spot' of the reg or whatever.
however, the benefit of mozzies is when you run them as fast as possible. Less time in flight and less mass means they are less affected by the wind, or so goes the theory.
So, if I was going to change to mozzies, I'd run them as fast as possible to get the most effect from them.
Do you know if your barrel likes them?

CB Chairman said...

ditto

Baltipal said...

Explain again why you feel the need for a change, wasn't Russ doing quite well with JSB 8.4s through it, do you doubt your ability to find a supply of JSBs?

Phil_G said...

so, should I get an air stripper/muzzle break, or a butt hook?
stripper is more aesthetic, butt hook is more useful????
but if the stripper reduces clicks at longer range by improving BC, then any establishing of clicks would be negated.
thoughts please

Phil_G said...

i have 10 tins of JSB's that could be made available at the right price

Arby said...

That's what I'll be experimenting with either tomorrow or Saturday. The main reason I'm reluctant to change the power unless absolutely necessary is that if it doesn't like Mossies I may not be able to get the power back to exactly where it originally was without a deal of fiddling.

CB Chairman said...

having had a go wih Swifty's EV I'd very much like a hook.

Baltipal said...

Several have expressed their doubts about the actual benefits of strippers, no one has said to me that butthooks are a load of rubbish though.

Baltipal said...

Well leave it where it is & keep using the JSB's then. Roy, you've took home two Trophys & were just outside a place last Sunday, if it works.......

Arby said...

Yes Greg, the M's are a lot easier to source. Plus, although I know it was hardly a scientific experiment, the few of Jonta's that I tried on Sat gave better or equal results to the JSB's without any conditioning to the barrel. So therefore, I think it reasonable to at least give them a try.

Phil_G said...

well its only a bit of one:
http://www.pmcb.co.uk/sitefiles/Pages/Steyr/Photo_Gallery6/main.html

Arby said...

Phil. I'd say butt hook. Tried Swifty's on Sunday.....felt great.

CB Chairman said...

price?

Phil_G said...

£55 inc delivery

CB Chairman said...

a snatch

Phil_G said...

I wish it was a snatch.
I've always fancied a proper Anschutz jobbie, but £200 is too steep

CB Chairman said...

time for be.

Greg if we're walking I suggest you get here for 7pm.

Phil_G said...

its only the rod and hook, not the rest, thats the original Steyr part.
£55 for less than a £1's worth of metal

CB Chairman said...

d

Phil_G said...

hope to be at the 'ride tomorrow pm zeroing in.
You out to play Roy?

Baltipal said...

Not a hope Shaun, if work is anything like today it'll be way past 6 before I get to leave. 8 to 8.30 best I can do mate., sorry!

Arby said...

I'll try Phil. What time are you going?

Phil_G said...

it will be mid afternoon.
got shopping and Chloe's school review am, so I can't fix a time, i would guess somewhere between 2 and 3.
If wet, in the scout hut.

Phil_G said...

if you want, i'll text you when i'm free

Baltipal said...

Lucky buggers, we're three blokes down at work so it will be building to a cresendo throughout the afternoon, I'll be lucky to lift my head between 3 & 6! Think of me at the coalface while you're experimenting with pellets & generally haveing the shooting fun!

Arby said...

That would be good, although nearer 3 should be better for me. Just looked at Metcheck...rain forecast between 10 and 1.

Phil_G said...

to both of you

Baltipal said...

Good night then lads, have fun. With a bit of luck I may make Saturday's action at the 'ride!

Arby said...

Greg, howabout if I come over and drive your truck while you get some shooting practice. I'd love a go on one.

Phil_G said...

night

CB Chairman said...

Skan is back online Gregory

Phil_G said...

zero'd in, ready to go

Arby said...

JSB's? Did you try M's. What's your fps?

I'm hoping to get to M/r at about 10 tomorrow to do my esperiments. By the time I'd been to the bank and then to chemists to pick up FIL's prescription there was no time for me to get back down there today.

CB Chairman said...

Roy is you're doing esperiments I think we should all keep clear. What you been drinking

CB Chairman said...

Oh shit ... if you're (lost its moment now!)

Baltipal said...

Shaun, lets just go down thwe Pub in the car, I'll drive.
I'll be there in about 30 mins.

Arby said...

What have I been drinking???? Sounds like the right question, but is it me you should be asking?
Hard day then, Shaun?

Baltipal said...

OK, new plan. Paul is picking me up at 8.30 so we should be with you for 8.50. God, I need a pint now!

No shooting today then Roy?

Arby said...

Didn't have time to get there with the gun Greg. I did manage to call in on young Phil for a couple of minutes as I was passing.

Arby said...

Have I got to set you up for the 200 then Greg? Enjoy your pint and have one for me.

Baltipal said...

I don't know mate, Sainbury's is due any second.

Have you seen this thread about competition pellets?

http://www.airgunforum.net/agf/index.php?&showtopic=49345&mode=show&st=0

Baltipal said...

So JSB Exacts & RWS Superfields are the same pellet!

Baltipal said...

..........and I take 200. If you snooze, you lose!

Arby said...

I've got to tell you Greg, Phil had that inscrutable "bring it on if you're 'ard enough" look on his face today. We can all watch out tomorrow, his targets will lie down in surrender.

CB Chairman said...

Bye chaps the pub car is calling, so at least if I blog later they'll be a reason for any cock up!

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